1 SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA
2 COUNTY OF SANTA CLARA
3 --oOo--
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5 RALPH SIMPSON, )
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6 Plaintiff, )
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7 vs. ) No. 105CV053398
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8 LOU RAE KAGEL; LYNN O'BRIEN; JAMES )
O'BRIEN; STONEHENGE PROPERTIES, )
9 INC.; VALLEY OF CALIFORNIA, INC. dba )
COLDWELL BANKER; DOUGLAS REA; and )
10 DOES ONE through TWENTY, inclusive, )
)
11 Defendants. )
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12 AND RELATED ACTIONS. )
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14
15 DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON
16 Wednesday, November 15, 2006
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21 Taken before JANELL SOKOL, CSR, CM
License No. C-3443, State of California
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23
DIABLO VALLEY REPORTING SERVICES
24 Certified Shorthand Reporters
2121 N. California Blvd., Suite 310
25 Walnut Creek, California 94596
925-930-7388 1
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 I N D E X
2 PAGE
3 EXAMINATION BY:
4 MR. KOSS 5
5 MR. THOMAS 88
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 BE IT REMEMBERED, that pursuant to notice to the
2 respective parties, and on Wednesday, the 15th day of
3 November, 2006, commencing at the hour of 9:00 a.m.
4 thereof, at the Law Offices of GAGEN, McCOY, McMAHON, KOSS,
5 MARKOWITZ & RAINES, 279 Front Street, Danville, California,
6 before me, JANELL SOKOL, a Certified Shorthand Reporter,
7 License No. C-3443, State of California, there personally
8 appeared:
9 THOMASENA SIMPSON,
10 called as a witness on behalf of the defendants, who, being
11 first duly sworn, was then and there examined and
12 interrogated as hereinafter set forth.
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16 PAUL G. MINOLETTI, Attorney at Law, representing
17 the Law Offices of GREENE, CHAUVEL, DESCALSO & MINOLETTI,
18 951 Mariner's Island Boulevard, Suite 630, San Mateo,
19 California 94404, appeared as counsel on behalf of the
20 plaintiff;
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22 CHARLES A. KOSS, Attorney at Law, representing the
23 Law Offices of GAGEN, McCOY, McMAHON, KOSS, MARKOWITZ &
24 RAINES, 279 Front Street, Danville, California 94526,
25 appeared as counsel on behalf of defendant Lou Rae Kagel;
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 STEPHEN W. THOMAS, Attorney at Law, representing
2 the Law Division of NRT Incorporated Western Division,
3 12657 Alcosta Boulevard, Suite 500, San Ramon, California
4 94583, appeared as counsel on behalf of defendant Valley of
5 California, Inc. dba Coldwell Banker.
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7 ALSO PRESENT was plaintiff RALPH SIMPSON.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 THOMASENA SIMPSON,
2 called as a witness on behalf of the defendants,
3 having first been duly sworn by the court reporter
4 to testify the truth, the whole truth and nothing
5 but the truth, testified as follows:
6 --oOo--
7 EXAMINATION
8 BY MR. KOSS:
9 Q. Can you please state your name and address.
10 A. Thomasena Ellen Simpson, 17682 Blanchard Drive,
11 Monte Sereno, California.
12 Q. Mrs. Simpson, my name is Charles Koss. I'm an
13 attorney. I represent Lou Rae Kagel in a case called Ralph
14 Simpson versus Lou Rae Kagel and I'd like to ask you some
15 questions about what you know about facts and circumstances
16 which led up to that case.
17 Have you ever been deposed before?
18 A. No.
19 Q. Have you had a chance to talk to your attorney
20 regarding what a deposition is all about?
21 A. On the phone.
22 Q. Okay. Although you may understand those
23 procedures, and I'm sure he can quote you almost verbatim
24 about what I'm going to say, I'm going to go through it
25 anyway just to make sure we're on the same page. Okay?
5
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Okay.
2 Q. First of all, you understand you've given an oath
3 to tell the truth?
4 A. Right.
5 Q. You understand that's the same oath that you'd
6 give in a court of law and the same penalties of perjury
7 apply, even though this is in my conference room?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. Okay. To your right we have a court reporter that
10 takes down everything anybody says and at some point she's
11 going to transcribe that into a booklet form that looks
12 like this. You may have seen deposition transcripts in
13 this case before, and you're going to have an opportunity
14 to read that transcript to make whatever changes you deem
15 appropriate.
16 Do you understand that?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. I want to caution you that if you do make changes,
19 I might be able to comment upon those changes and that
20 might affect your credibility if you change yeses to nos,
21 those kind of substantive changes. Okay?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. My advice to you is to answer as fully and
24 completely here as you can, so hopefully we can avoid too
25 many changes to your deposition transcript.
6
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Is that fair enough?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. I don't mean to trick you with any question. If
4 you don't understand something, please let me know and I'll
5 try and rephrase it so we have the same understanding of
6 the question.
7 Is that fair enough?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. Are you taking any medication that you think might
10 impair your ability to recollect and give your best
11 testimony today?
12 A. No.
13 Q. Is there any reason why you think you can't give
14 your best testimony today?
15 A. No.
16 Q. At some point if you need to take a break, you let
17 me know and we'll take a break. The only caveat I have to
18 that is if I've posed a question to you, I'd appreciate it
19 if you could first answer that question before asking to
20 take a break.
21 Is that okay?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. And lastly, you seem quite good at this, but if we
24 talk at the same time it makes it hard for the court
25 reporter to down what we're saying. Also, it's hard for
7
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 the court reporter to translate shakes of the head,
2 uh-huhs, uh-uhs, so if I may prompt you for an answer, it's
3 not that I'm being rude; I'm just trying to get a complete
4 record. Fair enough?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. Any questions about the process before we get
7 going?
8 A. No.
9 Q. Can you describe your educational background.
10 A. I went to college part time a couple of times.
11 That's it.
12 Q. Where did you go to college?
13 A. University of Idaho, University of North Carolina
14 -- NC State. Sorry.
15 Q. Can you describe for me your work background.
16 A. I worked when I was younger at an office supply
17 store, at restaurants, and then I stopped work after we had
18 kids.
19 Q. Okay. When was the last time you had a job
20 outside of the home?
21 A. I was 22.
22 Q. Great. How old are you now?
23 A. Fifty-two.
24 Q. So thirty years ago?
25 A. Yes.
8
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Now, from your husband's testimony I understand
2 that he first took a job with Cisco in 1994 and you moved
3 to California. Does that sound about right?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Where had you lived prior to that?
6 A. With IBM? North Carolina, Maryland, Seattle,
7 Idaho, Georgia, Kansas.
8 Q. Did you own a home in any of those places?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. Which ones?
11 A. Seattle, Maryland, North Carolina. Let's see. In
12 Seattle we owned two different houses.
13 I mentioned Maryland and North Carolina, right?
14 Q. Yes. I think you left out Idaho and Kansas. You
15 didn't have houses in those states?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Own houses in those states.
18 A. Right.
19 Q. Do you recall the first house that you purchased?
20 A. In Seattle.
21 Q. And what was your role in selecting and purchasing
22 the property?
23 A. We looked at some houses together and then we
24 decided on one, made a bid and bought it.
25 Q. Is this something you do jointly with your
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 husband?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. In any way did you split up the duties between the
4 two of you in terms of looking at the house, investigating
5 the house, making an offer on the house, getting financing,
6 all those kinds of things that go into a purchase?
7 A. No.
8 Q. Did you use a real estate agent to purchase a
9 house in Seattle, the first house?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. In the purchase of that house, did you run into
12 any difficulties in terms of what had been represented to
13 you about the house and what you actually found out once
14 you moved into the house?
15 A. No.
16 Q. What's the second house that you bought?
17 A. In Seattle.
18 Q. And did you and your husband again jointly look
19 at, negotiate for and purchase the property?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. You didn't split up the duties between one versus
22 the other?
23 A. At that time he looked at houses more than me
24 because I was home with two small kids.
25 Q. So is it correct that on the second house your
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 husband would have in essence screened the houses for you?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. And then once he found ones he thought you might
4 be interested, you'd go and look at them as well?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. In terms of the negotiation for the second house,
7 is that something your husband did or something you did or
8 something you both did?
9 A. We were both there but Ralph talks more than me.
10 Q. Okay. Do you consider your husband a better
11 negotiator than you?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Would you then defer to his ability to negotiate
14 on a house?
15 A. Now, that's pretty important.
16 Q. So you were involved in that process as well?
17 A. Yes. I felt -- we discussed everything, the price
18 of the house, how much to offer exactly, everything.
19 Q. Okay. After you moved into that house, did you
20 discover there were any inaccuracies in anything that had
21 been represented to you about the house?
22 A. No.
23 Q. What's the next house that you purchased?
24 A. That was in Gaithersburg, Maryland.
25 Q. And was there a reason why you were moving from
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Seattle to Maryland?
2 A. IBM.
3 Q. IBM transferred your husband?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. With respect to the purchase of the house in
6 Maryland, did you and your husband divide the duties in
7 terms of locating, negotiating for and purchasing the
8 property?
9 A. In terms -- excuse me.
10 Q. Sure. Let's break it down.
11 In terms of trying to locate a house in Maryland,
12 was that something that one of you took more responsibility
13 for?
14 A. I looked more. In Maryland I looked at more
15 houses.
16 Q. And why was that?
17 A. Because Ralph was at work.
18 Q. When you first moved to Maryland, were you living
19 in temporary housing?
20 A. We rented, yes.
21 Q. So while your husband was at work, you'd go and
22 try to find a house to buy?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. And would you kind of screen the houses and once
25 you saw ones your husband would like, you showed him those
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 houses?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. And in terms of the negotiation, that's something
4 that you and your husband did together?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. And did you have a real estate broker helping you
7 with the purchase of that property?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. After you moved into the property, were there any
10 items you thought had been misrepresented to you about that
11 property?
12 A. No.
13 Q. What was the next house after Maryland?
14 A. North Carolina.
15 Q. And that was another transfer?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Did you have a real estate agent helping you with
18 that property?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Who spent more time looking for houses in North
21 Carolina, you or your husband?
22 A. That time we did more looking together I thought,
23 but it was probably more me still.
24 Q. Okay. And after you moved in did you discover
25 there had been any misrepresentations regarding any aspect
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 of the property?
2 A. No.
3 Q. Where did you move to after North Carolina?
4 A. California.
5 Q. And that was the initial time you lived in
6 California when your husband first took a job with Cisco?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. As I understand it, you moved to the U.K. in '95,
9 about a year later.
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. Did you own a house during that one-year period in
12 California?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Where was that house located?
15 A. Almaden.
16 Q. Almaden?
17 A. Um-hum.
18 Q. Did one or the other of you spend more time
19 looking for that property?
20 A. Ralph did.
21 Q. And why was that?
22 A. Because I was in North Carolina cleaning up that
23 house, getting it ready for sale.
24 Q. From time to time did you make trips to California
25 to look at houses?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. And how many houses did you look at before you and
3 your husband decided on the Almaden property?
4 A. A lot. I couldn't pin a number on that now.
5 Q. Can you describe for me generally the Almaden
6 property that you did purchase, the size of it, that kind
7 of thing?
8 A. It was approximately 2400 square feet. I'm not
9 positive anymore.
10 Q. What was the size of the lot? Do you remember
11 that?
12 A. Small. No.
13 Q. Did it have a swimming pool?
14 A. No.
15 Q. And did you have a real estate agent help you with
16 the purchase of that property?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. Do you recall who the agent was?
19 A. No.
20 Q. After you moved into the property, did you believe
21 there was any misrepresentations made to you about the
22 condition of the property --
23 A. No.
24 Q. -- or any other aspect of the property?
25 A. No.
15
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. After you moved to the U.K., did at some point you
2 discover that your husband was going to be relocated back
3 to California?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. When was that?
6 A. After we had been there almost three years.
7 Q. So about 1998?
8 MR. SIMPSON: If I could interject here, we went
9 to Brussels first for about three years.
10 MR. KOSS: Ah. Thank you.
11 Q. When was it that you first learned you were going
12 to be moving back from the U.K. to California?
13 A. Just a couple months before we moved.
14 Q. Do you recall when it was that you purchased a
15 house in Blanchard?
16 A. Was it August?
17 Q. Yes, it was. In relation to the time that you
18 purchased the house on Blanchard, when did you first learn
19 that you would be moving back to the states?
20 A. It seemed like a very short time. I couldn't
21 pinpoint it. I mean I know --
22 Q. That's okay. All I'm asking for is your best
23 recollection.
24 A. Can I take a break?
25 MR. KOSS: Sure.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 (Recess at 9:28 a.m.)
2 (Resume at 9:34 a.m.)
3 BY MR. KOSS:
4 Q. Okay. When we broke I was trying to get an idea
5 of how long you had known that you were going to be moving
6 to California. All I'm trying to do is get an idea of how
7 long it was, when you first started looking for a house and
8 what you did; so that's really sort of the length of time
9 I'm looking for.
10 A. I don't know.
11 Q. After you discovered that you were going to move
12 back to California, what steps did you take to find a house
13 in California?
14 A. I came here on a trip to look at houses and I
15 looked at houses with Earl someone and then with Doug
16 someone.
17 Q. How many trips did you make?
18 A. One.
19 Q. How long were you here?
20 A. I'm not positive. I think ten days.
21 Q. Before you started looking at houses, had you
22 established in your mind what kind of criteria you were
23 looking for?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. What was that?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. A house that was fairly new or had been recently
2 remodeled, a pool, a nice garden or room for a nice garden.
3 The rooms had to be specific sizes because we had antiques,
4 so the dining room had to be big enough to hold the antique
5 table; and I had preferences but those things were musts.
6 The preferences were other things like wood trim and a view
7 would be great. I preferred Los Gatos over Saratoga,
8 things like that.
9 Q. Did you have a price range in mind?
10 A. Yes. Stay under 4 million.
11 Q. When you first came over from the U.K. to look at
12 houses, did you have any specific houses that you wanted to
13 look at, in other words, ones you had seen on the internet
14 or heard about from somebody, anything along those lines?
15 A. No.
16 Q. Prior to the time you came from the U.K. to look
17 at houses, had your husband to your knowledge looked at
18 houses?
19 A. I don't remember.
20 Q. One of the people you looked at houses with was a
21 person by the name of Earl?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Do you remember who he worked for?
24 A. I think Alain Pinel.
25 Q. How did you select Earl as a real estate agent to
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 help you look for houses in California?
2 A. Ralph did.
3 Q. Do you know how he selected Earl?
4 A. He knew someone that knew Earl.
5 Q. And you said a person by the name of Doug helped
6 you?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Is that Doug Rea?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. How did you select Mr. Rea as a person to help you
11 look at houses?
12 A. I just made a phone call to the real estate
13 office.
14 Q. And why did you do that?
15 A. Because I wanted to look more at houses in Los
16 Gatos.
17 Q. Did Earl specialize in some particular area and he
18 was unwilling to show you houses outside of that area?
19 A. Saratoga.
20 Q. And when you called and spoke to Doug Rea, were
21 you calling about a specific property?
22 A. I don't remember.
23 Q. After you spoken to Doug Rea, did you go and meet
24 with him?
25 A. Yes. He came and met me, yes.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Did he take you and show you specific houses?
2 A. He made a printout of all the houses and the price
3 range in Los Gatos and then we started touring.
4 Q. So when you first spoke to Doug, what criteria did
5 you give him in terms of what you were looking for?
6 A. I told him the same things I told Earl, that I
7 wanted a newer home or recently remodeled house with a pool
8 or room for a pool and a nice garden, and I also told him
9 about the antiques, needing certain size of rooms.
10 Q. During your trip to California to look at houses,
11 did you identify any particular houses that you thought
12 were worth making an offer on?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Which houses were those?
15 A. A Pinn Brothers house in Saratoga, the Blanchard
16 house and a house in -- the third house was in San Jose.
17 Q. I take it the Pinn Brothers house was brand new
18 construction.
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Did you make an offer on that property?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. Did you make an offer on that property before or
23 after you made an offer on the Blanchard property?
24 A. Before.
25 Q. And the San Jose property, did you ever make an
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 offer on that property?
2 A. We verbally talked to -- not on paper.
3 Q. Okay. You verbally talked to whom?
4 A. Someone at the house, a realtor or maybe the -- we
5 just -- they didn't sound like they were going to come
6 down, but it was still an option because it was a lot less
7 than either of the other houses.
8 Q. Do you remember how much the San Jose house was?
9 A. No.
10 Q. It was less, however, than Saratoga or Blanchard?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. Were you looking at all three houses at the same
13 time prior to making an offer on any one of them?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. Is there a reason why you first made an offer on
16 the Saratoga property as opposed to one of the other two?
17 A. It had more of the things we wanted.
18 Q. So that in terms of buying a house that was your
19 first choice, was the Saratoga property?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. And what features did that house have that you
22 liked over the Blanchard property and the San Jose
23 property?
24 A. A view.
25 Q. Anything else?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Wood trim.
2 Q. Anything else?
3 A. No, not that I recall.
4 Q. Do you recall what the asking price was of the
5 Saratoga property?
6 A. No.
7 Q. Do you recall how much you offered?
8 A. No.
9 Q. I assume your offer wasn't accepted.
10 A. Right.
11 Q. Do you know why that was?
12 A. It was too low.
13 Q. Did you have a real estate agent helping you with
14 that offer?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And was that Earl?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. Do you know if the Pinn Brothers made a
19 counteroffer to your proposal?
20 A. I don't remember. I think I was back in London by
21 the time some stuff like that happened.
22 Q. At the time the offer was made, were you present
23 at that time?
24 A. The first offer?
25 Q. Yes.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. I believe so.
2 Q. And the Pinn Brothers house had other aspects that
3 you liked, for instance, it was new?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Did it have a swimming pool?
6 A. No.
7 Q. Did it have room for a pool?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. Do you recall how the house was advertised in
10 terms of the possibility of putting in a pool?
11 A. No.
12 Q. Did you do any investigation of the Saratoga
13 property to determine how difficult or easy it would be to
14 install a pool?
15 A. No.
16 Q. Did you look into any of the rules or regulations
17 in the City of Saratoga in terms of what they allowed in
18 order to build a swimming pool?
19 A. No.
20 Q. Did you have any discussion with the seller about
21 how easy or difficult it would be to put in a pool?
22 A. No.
23 Q. Did you have any discussions with Earl about how
24 easy or difficult it would be to put in a pool?
25 A. I don't recall.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. At the time you made an offer on the Saratoga
2 property, did you have an estimate in your own mind as to
3 what it would cost to put in a swimming pool?
4 A. No.
5 Q. Is that -- strike that.
6 Was the cost of a swimming pool a factor that went
7 into your decision in terms of how much to offer for the
8 house?
9 A. I don't understand. Are you asking compared to a
10 house that already had a pool?
11 Q. Well, I guess what I'm suggesting is, if the house
12 is $4 million, did you subtract some amount off of that
13 saying, well, I need this much money to put in a pool, so
14 I'm offering less?
15 A. No.
16 Q. Was the cost of a swimming pool important to you?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. I guess what I'm getting at is this. If you make
19 an offer on the Saratoga property and you were successful
20 in buying the property and later discover that a pool would
21 be hundreds of thousands of dollars, that could be beyond
22 your price range in terms of putting in the pool; and I'm
23 wondering if you made any investigation to determine
24 whether or not the Saratoga house with the subsequently
25 installed pool would be within your budget?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. We talked about there might be reinforcement on
2 the house -- on the pool on the Saratoga property.
3 Q. And that's because it was on a hillside?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Did you investigate the cost of that at all?
6 A. No.
7 Q. Did you discuss with anyone any potential prices
8 of a swimming pool?
9 A. No.
10 Q. Did you discuss that with your husband?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And what was discussed between you and your
13 husband about the potential cost of the swimming pool at
14 the Saratoga property?
15 A. He said it would probably cost a little more.
16 Q. Was he more specific than that?
17 A. No.
18 Q. Did he say a little more than what?
19 A. Than a house on flat ground -- than a pool on flat
20 ground.
21 Q. Up to this point, that is, the time you're making
22 the offer on the Saratoga property, had you ever installed
23 a pool at any of your prior homes?
24 A. No.
25 Q. Had you ever priced out a pool at any of your
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 prior homes?
2 A. No.
3 Q. Did you have any idea what it cost to put in a
4 swimming pool?
5 A. No.
6 Q. At some point did you come to the conclusion that
7 you were not going to be able to purchase the Saratoga home
8 at the price you wanted to pay?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. And at that point did you and your husband decide
11 to submit an offer on the Blanchard property?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Is there a reason why you decided to submit an
14 offer on the Blanchard property as opposed to the San Jose
15 property as you discussed before?
16 A. The schools are better in Los Gatos.
17 Q. Any other factor?
18 A. The town of Los Gatos is better than San Jose to
19 live in.
20 Q. Now, the Blanchard property is actually in the
21 town of Monte Sereno?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Is that basically the same as Los Gatos?
24 A. To me, yes.
25 Q. The same school district?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. Can you describe for me generally the San Jose
3 property?
4 A. It was a redone farmhouse.
5 Q. Did it have a pool?
6 A. No.
7 Q. Do you know if it had room for a pool?
8 A. We talked to the person there about that.
9 Q. What did that person tell you?
10 A. They showed us where they thought it would be a
11 good place to put a pool.
12 Q. Do you recall the size of the property, the lot
13 size?
14 A. No.
15 Q. Did you do any investigation about the cost to put
16 in a pool at the San Jose property?
17 A. No.
18 Q. The person that you talked to, did he give you any
19 estimates or ideas of what it might cost to put in a pool?
20 A. No.
21 Q. Now, did the Saratoga property have a guest house?
22 A. No.
23 Q. Did it have any other auxiliary buildings besides
24 the main house?
25 A. No, no.
27
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Is a guest house one of the criteria you were
2 looking at in buying a house?
3 A. It was a plus.
4 Q. That wasn't one of the specific criteria you were
5 looking at though?
6 A. The must haves, no.
7 Q. What about the San Jose property, did that have a
8 guest house?
9 A. No.
10 Q. Did it have any auxiliary buildings?
11 A. No.
12 Q. In looking at the Saratoga property, it was your
13 intent that if you bought the property, you would put in a
14 pool, correct?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Was it also your intent to install a guest house
17 at the Saratoga property?
18 A. We had said something about we could put in a pool
19 house but -- for a billiard room, but that's all we talked
20 about.
21 Q. And who did you talk to about that?
22 A. Ralph and I talked together about that.
23 Q. What were you envisioning in terms of a pool house
24 in terms of square feet, amenities, that kind of thing?
25 A. Something like his friend -- I don't know.
28
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Ralph has a friend who has a pool house?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. And you just said something about a pool table?
4 A. Yes. He has a billiard table in it.
5 Q. I see. Okay. And were you thinking about
6 bathrooms and that sort of thing in this pool house?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Changing rooms?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. Did you do any investigation in terms of whether
11 or not you could construct a pool house on the Saratoga
12 property?
13 A. No.
14 Q. Was there any representation made to you about
15 whether or not you could do something like that?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Was that important to you at the time you
18 submitted the offer on the Saratoga property, that is, the
19 potential of putting in a pool house?
20 A. No.
21 Q. In other words, if you acquired the Saratoga
22 property it would be nice if you could put in a pool house,
23 but if you found out you couldn't, that would be okay, too?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. Did you make any investigation on the San Jose
29
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 property about whether or not you could construct any
2 auxiliary buildings?
3 A. No.
4 Q. Did you and your husband talk about, if you
5 purchased the San Jose property, installing a pool?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. What about installing a pool house?
8 A. We didn't talk about that one, no.
9 Q. I understand that you and your husband have now
10 purchased a lot.
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And when did you purchase the lot?
13 A. I don't know.
14 Q. Do you have an estimate?
15 A. More than a year ago.
16 Q. If I told you it was in April of 2005, would that
17 sound about right?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. Have you taken any steps to develop that property?
20 A. We hired an architect.
21 Q. When did you first hire an architect?
22 A. About a year ago.
23 Q. So shortly after you purchased the property, you
24 hired an architect?
25 A. Yes.
30
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. And where are you at this point in the development
2 process?
3 A. Still ironing out the floor plan.
4 Q. Is that property on Overlook Road in Los Gatos?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. Have you made any applications to the City of Los
7 Gatos for any kind of development permits?
8 A. No.
9 Q. I take it at some point you and your husband have
10 discussed the idea of buying a lot and building a house to
11 your own specifications, correct?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. When did you first start having those kind of
14 discussions? Has this been going on for many, many years?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Have you had those kind of discussions even say
17 when you went to the U.K.?
18 A. We bought a lot in Seattle.
19 Q. And you built a house in Seattle?
20 A. No. We had to move.
21 Q. But even when you were in Seattle, that was your
22 dream, to buy a lot, build something that the two of you
23 could specify every detail of the house?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. When you moved back from the U.K. to California,
31
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 was it your and your husband's plan to buy a house sort of
2 as a temporary step while you looked for a lot to build a
3 house?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. When you first moved back from the U.K. to
6 California, did you and your husband have a time frame on
7 this plan for finding a lot and building a house?
8 A. No. I told him to take his time and find the
9 right lot.
10 Q. And since you've moved back to California, have
11 you and your husband spent some time looking for lots?
12 A. A little, not tons.
13 Q. Okay. How did you find the lot on Overlook Road
14 in Los Gatos?
15 A. I don't know. Ralph found it.
16 Q. You don't know how he found it?
17 A. No.
18 Q. Did he come home one day and say something like
19 hey, honey, I've found this really great lot, we ought to
20 go look at it, or words to that effect?
21 A. I think he found it on the internet.
22 Q. And did he show it to you on the internet before
23 you physically went out and looked at it?
24 A. I don't know.
25 Q. Did you hire a real estate agent to help you with
32
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 that transaction?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. Who was that?
4 A. I don't remember her name.
5 Q. How did you select that particular agent?
6 A. She had the lot listed.
7 Q. Did the agent work for a brokerage?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. Do you know which one?
10 A. Coldwell Banker.
11 Q. Now, Coldwell Banker assisted you in the purchase
12 of the Blanchard property as well, correct?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. And Coldwell Banker had the listing on the
15 Blanchard property as well?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Was there anything about that transaction which
18 led you to say I'm not going to use Coldwell Banker for my
19 next transaction?
20 A. I thought that, yes.
21 Q. But despite that you decided to use Coldwell
22 Banker again for your next transaction?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. Now, you at least preliminarily have some plans
25 that you're working on on this Overlook Road property in
33
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Los Gatos?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. Have you gone through a number of revisions?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Are you pretty close to in your mind being done
6 with the design of the house?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Can you describe for me generally what the design
9 of the house is?
10 A. Spanish revival, large house.
11 Q. How many square feet?
12 A. I think at this point it's 8,000.
13 Q. And what about other amenities of the house? How
14 many bedrooms is this?
15 A. Five.
16 Q. The number of bedrooms, are those important to
17 you?
18 A. No.
19 Q. Not really?
20 A. No.
21 Q. The size of the dining room, for instance, would
22 be important to you, correct?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. The size of the living room might be important to
25 you, the size of the kitchen might be important to you?
34
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. Okay. Is there -- how big is the property?
3 A. Five acres.
4 Q. And is it flat?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Is there room for a pool?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Have you done anything to investigate the ability
9 to put in a pool?
10 A. You mean calling the city or something like that?
11 No. We talked to the architect about it.
12 Q. And what does the architect say about that?
13 A. Oh, there's a couple of good places.
14 Q. Is there room for a garden?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Have you specified any kind of cabling inside of
17 the house for computers, TVs, that kind of thing?
18 A. No. Ralph has talked about that.
19 Q. What has he talked about?
20 A. Making sure it's future ready.
21 Q. And to your understanding is any particular type
22 of cabling being specified?
23 A. That's all he said to me.
24 Q. By future ready did he describe any particular
25 product he had in mind?
35
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. I assumed he meant fiber optics but I didn't ask
2 him.
3 Q. And why do you assume that?
4 A. Because he wants a lot of technical things in the
5 house.
6 Q. What are fiber optics?
7 A. I have no clue.
8 Q. Does your current house have fiber optics?
9 A. No.
10 Q. Have you ever had a house that has fiber optics?
11 A. No.
12 Q. How does the lack of fiber optics in your current
13 house affect your day-to-day enjoyment and use of the
14 property?
15 A. I assume that the computer would be faster.
16 Q. Do you notice that your computer is too slow?
17 A. Sometimes. We have DSL.
18 Q. And how would fiber optics speed up your computer?
19 A. I don't know.
20 Q. When you were looking for houses prior to the time
21 you bought the Blanchard property, was fiber optics one of
22 the criteria you were looking for in a house?
23 A. No.
24 Q. That was just one of those things that, like the
25 guesthouse, it was nice if it had it?
36
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. Now, you understood when you bought the Blanchard
3 property, it was represented to have fiber optics?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Was that a factor in your deciding to buy the
6 Blanchard property say as opposed to the San Jose property?
7 A. No, not for me.
8 Q. Do you recall discussing with your husband that
9 you should maybe make a higher offer for the Blanchard
10 property because of the fact that it had fiber optics?
11 A. No.
12 Q. Was that something you were willing to pay for?
13 A. I would have left that up to Ralph. I don't know
14 what fiber optics is.
15 Q. On the plans that your architect has drawn, has he
16 put a pool on the plans as of yet?
17 A. No. We're still on house plans. We don't have a
18 garden plan yet.
19 Q. Does the house have a guesthouse?
20 A. No.
21 Q. Do you anticipate building a guesthouse?
22 A. No. That house is big enough.
23 Q. Have you discussed with your architect building
24 any kind of auxiliary buildings?
25 A. No.
37
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Do you anticipate building any kind of auxiliary
2 buildings?
3 A. No.
4 Q. Have you decided to build this house on Overlook
5 Road because of any aspects of the Blanchard property that
6 you don't like?
7 A. No.
8 Q. In other words, there is nothing about the
9 property that you say I just can't live with this;
10 therefore, we need to move and build another house?
11 A. No.
12 Q. When do you anticipate starting construction on
13 the Overlook Road property?
14 A. It will probably be another year or so at least.
15 We're slow, no hurry.
16 Q. You're not in a hurry because when it gets done,
17 it gets done. You're just not that concerned about it?
18 A. No. I want us to take our time.
19 Q. You want to make sure you carefully think about
20 all the aspects, make sure you're making the right
21 decisions?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. And you'd rather take your time and do that
24 correctly rather than hurry and get it done?
25 A. Yes.
38
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Do you foresee any impediments to your building
2 out the Overlook property and moving into it?
3 A. No.
4 Q. Once you finish the Overlook Road property and
5 move into it, what are your plans for the Blanchard
6 property?
7 A. To sell it.
8 Q. After you made the offer on the Saratoga property,
9 it was clear to you that the seller wasn't going to accept
10 your price, is it correct that you then called Doug Rea and
11 had him make an offer for you on the Blanchard property?
12 A. Ralph did. I was in London.
13 Q. So by the time the offers were made on Blanchard,
14 you were back in the U.K.?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Between you and your husband Ralph, who first
17 looked at the Blanchard property?
18 A. I did.
19 Q. And how did you first learn about the Blanchard
20 property?
21 A. From Doug.
22 Q. And is it correct that you and Doug first went to
23 look at the property just the two of you?
24 A. Yes, I think so.
25 Q. Now, you've looked at the property with your
39
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 husband as well, correct?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. Are there times you looked at the property just by
4 yourself?
5 A. Just me?
6 Q. Yes.
7 A. No.
8 Q. So is it correct that each time you looked at the
9 property would have been either with Doug Rea or your
10 husband or with both?
11 A. I think so.
12 Q. Do you recall looking at the property on occasions
13 when Doug Rea wasn't there?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. How many times prior to the close of escrow did
16 you look at the Blanchard property?
17 A. It's blurry.
18 Q. That's okay. All I'm looking for is your best
19 recollection.
20 A. Six. Before the close of escrow, those at the
21 end, right? Yes.
22 Q. Now, you looked at it once with Doug Rea without
23 your husband the first time you saw it?
24 A. Right.
25 Q. And then how many more times did you look at it
40
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 before you went back to the U.K.?
2 A. I'm not sure. Several.
3 Q. Well, is it correct that after looking at the
4 Blanchard property, you said in substance to your husband,
5 hey, I think I've found a property we might be interested
6 in, why don't you come look at it with me?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. And did you and your husband go look at it?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. Was Doug Rea there on that occasion?
11 A. I'm not positive how all that went. That was a
12 long time ago.
13 Q. I understand. All I'm looking for is your best
14 recollection.
15 A. I don't remember.
16 Q. Did you look at it more than those two times on
17 this house-hunting trip you made from the U.K.?
18 A. I think, yes.
19 Q. Why don't we start with the first time. What do
20 you recollect about that visit to the property?
21 A. I just remember walking in and it had tall
22 ceilings and that the dining room was big enough and that
23 there was room for a nice garden and a pool, and it was
24 new, which was a plus.
25 Q. Was there anyone at the property at the time you
41
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 first looked at it other than yourself and Mr. Rea?
2 A. The problem is I don't remember which times, the
3 first time, the second time, the third time, that I met
4 Lynn or Lou Rae. I can remember meeting them.
5 Q. Okay.
6 A. But I can't tell you -- I'm trying to be precise
7 and I don't remember.
8 Q. Sure. You had a number of meetings and at this
9 point it's hard to separate the meetings that you had?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. Or the house visits that you had?
12 A. Right.
13 Q. Before looking at the property, did Mr. Rea
14 provide to you any documents that described the property?
15 A. The first time?
16 Q. Yes.
17 A. I don't know. He always had a list of things.
18 Q. Let me show you a document that we marked as
19 Exhibit 29 to your husband's deposition.
20 By the way, have you looked at any of the
21 depositions in this case?
22 A. Just Ralph's.
23 Q. And you read through that?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And what was your purpose in doing that?
42
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. I wanted to see how bad it was to have a
2 deposition.
3 Q. When did you look at his deposition?
4 A. Two days ago.
5 Q. In looking at his deposition, did that refresh
6 your recollection of some of the events that happened back
7 at the time that you and your husband purchased the
8 Blanchard property?
9 A. Yes, but it also made me think how I can't put
10 things in a time line.
11 Q. Let me show you Exhibit 29. When these were
12 produced these were clipped together with a paper clip like
13 this, which is why I've identified them as one document. I
14 think it's a number of different documents.
15 What I want to do is direct your attention to a
16 page that's marked at the bottom P93 and ask you if you
17 recognize that document.
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. Is that the kind of document that Doug Rea would
20 give you prior to looking at a particular piece of
21 property?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Do you recall getting this document before you
24 actually went into the Blanchard property?
25 A. No, I don't recall that specifically. I remember
43
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 getting this.
2 Q. Do you recall when you got this?
3 A. No.
4 Q. Would it have been before close of escrow?
5 A. Sure.
6 Q. Would it have been during the time you were out
7 here during those ten days looking at houses?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. When you looked at P93, did you make any
10 particular note of any of the features of the property?
11 A. Sure. The possible pool site.
12 Q. That was important to you, wasn't it?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Did you note the square footage of the property up
15 towards the top?
16 A. No. I was -- no.
17 Q. Was square footage a particular criteria that you
18 were looking for in a house?
19 A. No. I didn't have a specific square foot in mind.
20 Q. You didn't have a minimum, say I want a house
21 that's at least 5500 square feet?
22 A. No, I didn't have that.
23 Q. It was more the size of the living room, kitchen,
24 dining room kind of thing, right?
25 A. Right.
44
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. And if I can direct your attention to page P90,
2 which is the very first page of Exhibit 29, do you recall
3 receiving this document at some point?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. When do you recall first seeing this document?
6 A. I can't recall exactly, specifically.
7 Q. Was it during that ten days that you were out here
8 looking at houses?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. If I could have you turn the page to P91. Do you
11 recall receiving this document?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Did you receive this document at the time you were
14 out here on that house-hunting trip?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Now, the next page is P92. Is that a document you
17 also received during that house-hunting trip?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. Is that document --
20 MR. SIMPSON: If I could interrupt, that's the
21 back of the previous page.
22 MR. KOSS: Just my question.
23 Q. Is that document separate from any of these other
24 documents or part of another document?
25 A. Is it separate? I don't know. It's the back --
45
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Do you recall that being the back of Exhibit --
2 strike that.
3 Do you recall that P92 was the back of P91?
4 A. No.
5 Q. And P93 is the info link document we looked at
6 before and then there's a series of pages from P94 through
7 P102.
8 Do you recall receiving that set of documents, P94
9 through P102?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. Were those all separate documents or was that all
12 part of one document?
13 A. One document.
14 Q. And did you receive this document prior to --
15 strike that.
16 Did you receive this document while you were out
17 here on that house-hunting trip?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. Prior to the time you went back to the U.K., had
20 you noticed that the brochures had different descriptions
21 of the square footage of the property?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. When did you first notice that discrepancy?
24 A. Right away. There was a sign up one day that said
25 almost one acre. Then there were different numbers than
46
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 these.
2 Q. Okay. And did you also notice that at some point
3 at some places the house was described as having a total of
4 5300 square feet; another place was described as having a
5 total of 5100 square feet?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. And you saw that before you went back to the U.K.?
8 A. That's a good question. I don't know. I don't
9 know if Ralph mentioned it to me later.
10 Q. When did he mention it to you?
11 A. I'm not positive. I'm not sure if it was while I
12 was here or later. No, it was while I was here because I
13 had two different brochures that had 51 and 53, I'm pretty
14 sure.
15 Q. And that's something that you and Ralph discussed
16 before you went back to the U.K. and that is there seemed
17 to be a discrepancy of the square footage of the house?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. Let's go to the times that you were at the house
20 and the discussions you had with Lynn O'Brien and Lou Rae
21 Kagel.
22 I take it on at least one or more visits during
23 the time you were out here on the house-hunting trip, you
24 met at the Blanchard property and met Lou Rae Kagel,
25 correct?
47
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. How many times do you recall meeting her during
3 that trip?
4 A. At least once.
5 Q. Do you remember any of the discussion you had with
6 Lou Rae Kagel?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Okay. Can you describe for me what you and she
9 discussed.
10 A. Well, Lou Rae and Lynn both were standing at the
11 counter in the kitchen and I said on one of these brochures
12 it says room for a pool and other building, and I said can
13 you have both then; and they both shook their heads yes,
14 said yes and bobbed their heads up and down like
15 bobble-head dolls, and then Lou Rae said the other building
16 could be an office or a garage in the back yard, and went
17 on to specify about the driveway.
18 Because I was surprised about where would this go,
19 where would this go in the back yard, another building, and
20 she showed both corners of the back yard and then she said
21 she would put it in the corner so that you could continue
22 the garage back -- I mean the driveway back. Excuse me.
23 Q. So you're standing in the kitchen having this
24 conversation and then you walk out to the back of the
25 property and Lou Rae shows you these various areas?
48
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. And she showed you areas where she thought you
3 could install a garage?
4 A. Another building.
5 Q. And she said it could be an office or a garage?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. At the time that you made an offer on the
8 Blanchard property, were you contemplating building an
9 office or a garage?
10 A. No.
11 Q. Had you ever thought about building an office or a
12 garage?
13 A. A garage, yes.
14 Q. Have you done any investigation as to whether or
15 not that's possible on this property?
16 A. No. No, it's not possible on this property.
17 Q. And how do you know that?
18 A. Because Brian Loventhal said.
19 Q. Have you ever met Brian Loventhal?
20 A. No. Ralph met with Brian.
21 Q. So your husband Ralph came back and said I talked
22 to Brian Loventhal and he said what?
23 A. That there is no possibility of an outbuilding.
24 Q. Were you disappointed to discover that?
25 A. Only if Ralph decided to collect cars, not really.
49
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. You had no interest in having a garage?
2 A. No.
3 Q. Did you have any interest in having an office?
4 A. No.
5 Q. Had your husband expressed an interest in building
6 a garage to you?
7 A. I overheard him and my son talking about it.
8 Q. And what did you overhear?
9 A. That they wanted to buy a Morgan and put it in the
10 garage.
11 Q. And you heard that on one occasion?
12 A. On several.
13 Q. It was an ongoing topic of discussion between your
14 husband and your son?
15 A. Something like I would really like.
16 Q. Would you really like a Morgan?
17 A. I would really like my husband to have one.
18 Q. Has he ever expressed that he would really like
19 your husband to have another garage?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. I understand you have three children.
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. What are their names?
24 A. Matthew, Teresa, Ryan.
25 Q. How old is Matthew?
50
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Thirty.
2 Q. What does he do?
3 A. He's a genetic engineer.
4 Q. Where does he live?
5 A. San Diego.
6 Q. And Teresa, how old is she?
7 A. Oh, my gosh. Twenty-eight.
8 Q. And what does Teresa do?
9 A. She's a consultant.
10 Q. What does she consult on?
11 A. Computer stuff, I think.
12 Q. And how old is Ryan?
13 A. Ryan is 22.
14 Q. And what does he do?
15 A. He's a student.
16 Q. Did you seek Matthew's advice or counsel with
17 respect to the purchase of the Blanchard property?
18 A. No.
19 Q. Do you know if he looked at it before you bought
20 it?
21 A. He didn't.
22 Q. How about Teresa? Did you consult with her about
23 the purchase of the Blanchard property?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. In what way did you consult with her?
51
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. I just showed her the house.
2 Q. So she saw it before you made an offer?
3 A. I'm not positive. Yes, because Doug mentioned
4 her. I'm not positive.
5 Q. At some point she saw the house before you closed
6 escrow?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. And where does Teresa live?
9 A. Livermore.
10 Q. Do you know the address in Livermore?
11 A. No, not off the top of my head.
12 Q. What's Teresa's last name?
13 A. Simpson.
14 Q. So at least on one occasion Teresa met with you
15 and Mr. Rea at the property?
16 A. I just remember that e-mail that he said your
17 daughter Teresa really wanted a pool, so I was trying to
18 figure out if he saw her or -- I remember her being in the
19 back yard talking to me about the pool.
20 Q. Do you recall Teresa being in the back yard
21 talking to anybody else about the pool?
22 A. No.
23 Q. Do you recall her talking to Lou Rae Kagel about
24 the pool?
25 A. No.
52
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Do you have any reason to believe she did talk to
2 Lou Rae Kagel about a swimming pool in the back of the
3 Blanchard property?
4 A. No.
5 Q. Do you have any reason to believe Teresa talked to
6 Lynn O'Brien about a swimming pool in the back of the
7 Blanchard property?
8 A. No.
9 Q. After that little segue, let me get back to the
10 meeting that you had with Lynn O'Brien and Lou Rae Kagel.
11 Did Lynn O'Brien walk out into the back yard with
12 you and Lou Rae Kagel to discuss possible sites for this
13 auxiliary building?
14 A. I don't know.
15 Q. When you had this discussion with Lou Rae Kagel
16 and Lynn O'Brien, was there anyone else present?
17 A. Ralph was on the property but not in the kitchen.
18 Q. Did he go out in the back yard with you to inspect
19 the potential building sites for this auxiliary building?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Any other discussion you can remember having that
22 day with Lou Rae Kagel?
23 A. No.
24 Q. Any other discussion you recall having that day
25 with Lynn O'Brien?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Lynn said something about we were lucky to be able
2 to build both, and she said they had plans for a pool, that
3 she had plans for a pool, but decided not to put them in
4 because the new owner would want to do that.
5 Q. Did she mention anything about a sport court?
6 A. I don't recall that.
7 Q. Do you recall discussing any of the features of
8 the Blanchard house, other than what you've already told
9 me, with Lou Rae Kagel?
10 A. The air conditioning later.
11 Q. What was discussed about the air conditioning?
12 A. I was only there for that last -- the day before
13 closing on the air conditioning.
14 Q. We'll get to that in a minute then.
15 Anything else that was discussed about the
16 Blanchard property in the time you were there with Lou Rae
17 Kagel and Lynn O'Brien?
18 A. I think I asked -- I don't remember. I think I
19 asked if the concrete was dyed or if it was regular color,
20 because I would want to match that around the pool. But
21 that's -- and they said yes, it was dyed and it would be
22 easy to match.
23 Q. When you said they said that, was there one
24 particular person that said that?
25 A. No. I just remember getting that information.
54
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. At the time you were there with Lou Rae Kagel and
2 Lynn O'Brien, was it an open house?
3 A. I don't know. I don't remember.
4 Q. Had you ever been at the house during an open
5 house?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. Who do you recall being there during the open
8 house?
9 A. I remember going there one time when it was just
10 Lynn and that's when we figured out she was the builder.
11 Q. How did you figure out that she was the builder?
12 A. She said something about -- she kept saying I
13 planned the decorating or I did -- she was saying specific
14 things she did, and I thought she was a realtor, and then I
15 was embarrassed because then I thought what if I said bad
16 things about it and I hurt her feelings.
17 Q. Okay.
18 A. And then -- because you walk in and look at a
19 house and say, oh, I hate this flooring, or something, you
20 know; and so I was worried. So I remember specifically
21 when I found out going, oh, my God, she is the builder.
22 And then when I asked her something about it, she was very
23 adamant that it was her, she was in charge of building the
24 house and making the decisions.
25 Q. Were there things you hated about the Blanchard
55
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 property?
2 A. No. Hated, no. I thought the -- I don't like the
3 kitchen flooring, things like that, minor things.
4 Q. Now, the brochures that are part of Exhibit 29, is
5 it correct that you picked those up while you were in the
6 Blanchard property?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Did you discuss any of the brochures with Lynn
9 O'Brien?
10 A. No.
11 Q. Did you ask her any questions about any of the
12 specifications set forth on any of the brochures?
13 A. No, I don't remember.
14 Q. Do you recall discussing with either Lou Rae Kagel
15 or Lynn O'Brien the discrepancy about the square footage of
16 the house?
17 A. No. I just remember Ralph calling it the
18 incredible shrinking house.
19 Q. And who did he make that comment to?
20 A. I think Doug and I.
21 Q. And that was during one of the visits to the
22 house?
23 A. I think so.
24 Q. That was before you went back to the U.K.?
25 A. Yes.
56
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Was it important to you whether the house had 5100
2 square feet or 5300 square feet?
3 A. To live there, no.
4 Q. Did it make a difference to you in terms of the
5 price you were willing to pay for the property?
6 A. Yes, because I understand now in California the
7 size of the lot and the size of the house is very important
8 for the price.
9 Q. What steps did you take to determine whether or
10 not the square footage of the house was 5100 versus 5300?
11 A. I didn't do anything.
12 Q. Is there a reason why?
13 A. I was in London.
14 Q. Is it correct the reason you didn't make an
15 investigation as to the shrinking 200 feet is because it
16 wasn't important to you?
17 A. No. It is important to the price but not to me
18 living there.
19 Q. At the time that you and your husband made an
20 offer on the Blanchard property, what did you believe was
21 the square footage of the house?
22 A. I don't know.
23 Q. And at the time you didn't know?
24 A. I don't remember what I thought back then.
25 Q. Okay. So back then you can't remember if you
57
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 thought it was only 5100 or 5300 at the time you made the
2 offer?
3 A. Correct.
4 Q. Now, you mentioned something about a description
5 of the property that said almost an acre. Where did you
6 see that representation?
7 A. On the flip chart.
8 Q. And where was this flip chart?
9 A. One time it was outside and one time it was in the
10 kitchen.
11 Q. The time it was in the kitchen, was that the
12 second time or the first time?
13 A. Boy, I don't recall that.
14 Q. And it said nearly an acre?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Do you recall any other description of the
17 property on this flip chart?
18 A. No.
19 Q. Do you remember anything else that was said on
20 this flip chart other than nearly an acre?
21 A. No. It was basically this brochure, I mean these
22 things. So I already had this in my hand.
23 Q. Okay. And in looking at the brochure, did you see
24 that the brochure described the property as two-thirds of
25 an acre?
58
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. And that's something we talked about before.
3 That's a discrepancy you noted prior to the time you went
4 back to the U.K., correct?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. Did you discuss that issue with Lou Rae Kagel?
7 A. Did I? No.
8 Q. Did you discuss that issue with Lynn O'Brien?
9 A. No.
10 Q. What steps did you take to determine which was the
11 correct description of the property, nearly an acre or
12 two-thirds of an acre?
13 A. Ralph mentioned -- told Doug, I think mentioned it
14 to Doug.
15 Q. What did you find out?
16 A. That it was smaller.
17 Q. It was two-thirds of an acre?
18 A. And then Ralph looked it up on something on line,
19 too, but I didn't specifically do anything, no.
20 Q. Prior to the time you went back to the U.K., had
21 you determined that the property was only two-thirds of an
22 acre?
23 A. I'm not sure that was before or he called me later
24 and told me that he looked it up on line.
25 Q. Do you know if it was before or after you made an
59
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 offer on the property?
2 A. I'm not positive. We made that first offer right
3 when I -- didn't we make that a few days after I left?
4 Q. I don't know.
5 A. I'm not sure. That time line is kind of blurry.
6 Q. In making an offer on the Blanchard property, was
7 it important to you whether the property was two-thirds of
8 an acre or nearly an acre?
9 A. For resale, yes. But it was big enough for my
10 garden.
11 Q. Would it seem logical that you would not have made
12 an offer on the property until you had determined which was
13 the correct size of the lot?
14 A. I don't know if Ralph made the offer before or
15 after that.
16 Q. At the time you and your husband made an offer --
17 strike that.
18 The offer on the property was simply an offer made
19 by your husband on the property. Do you recall that?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Why was that?
22 A. Because I was in London.
23 Q. At the time your husband submitted an offer on the
24 property, did you believe the property was nearly an acre?
25 A. No.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. At the time your husband submitted an offer on the
2 property, the Blanchard property, did you believe that the
3 property was only two-thirds of an acre?
4 A. I'm not positive about the number two-thirds. I
5 know there was something that said two-thirds. This one
6 says two-thirds.
7 Q. Right. You're looking at the document P90, the
8 first page of Exhibit 29 talks about two-thirds of an acre.
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. And that's the document you had --
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. -- well before you made the offer, correct?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Is it correct that at the time your husband made
15 the offer, you believed the property, the size of the
16 property, was something less than nearly an acre?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. We've already discussed when you looked at the
19 property the idea of room for a pool, that was very
20 important to you, correct?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. The brochures talk about the ability to construct
23 some other building. Did you at any time prior to making
24 an offer on the property have any idea in your mind as to
25 what that might be?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. No. We talked about it, would we want something
2 there, and Brian of course said his dad should build a
3 garage; but Ralph said it was good for resale, though.
4 Q. And other than that it wasn't of importance to
5 you?
6 A. No.
7 Q. Other than what you've already told me, do you
8 recall having any other discussions with Lou Rae Kagel
9 about the Blanchard property during that ten-day
10 house-hunting trip?
11 A. No.
12 Q. Other than what you've already told me, do you
13 recall any other discussions that you had with Lynn O'Brien
14 during that ten-day house-hunting trip?
15 A. No.
16 Q. Do you recall when it was you went back to the
17 U.K.?
18 A. No.
19 Q. I'll represent to you that the offer your husband
20 made on the Blanchard property was dated August 15, 2001.
21 In relation to that date, can you tell me when you
22 went back to the U.K.?
23 A. I think I went back a day or two before.
24 Q. Something like the 13th or 14th, something like
25 that?
62
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. I think so.
2 Q. And is it correct that when you flew out here for
3 this house-hunting trip, you already had booked your return
4 flight to the U.K.?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. When was the next time you returned to California?
7 A. The 21st of September.
8 Q. Was that before or after you closed escrow on the
9 Blanchard property?
10 A. Before.
11 Q. Do you know how far before?
12 A. No.
13 Q. Under the original offer that your husband made on
14 the property, do you know if that offer proposed a specific
15 date for close of escrow?
16 A. I don't know.
17 Q. Did the events of September 11 impede your ability
18 to buy this property in some way?
19 A. Yes. I needed to come back and sign some papers,
20 yes.
21 Q. And what papers were those?
22 A. I have no clue.
23 Q. After you went back to the U.K. in the middle of
24 August, when did you make arrangements to come back to
25 California?
63
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. As soon as we had the movers lined up.
2 Q. When did you actually move your furniture from the
3 U.K.?
4 A. They were moving my furniture on 9/11, putting it
5 on the truck in a container.
6 Q. Did you wait until you actually had a deal on the
7 Blanchard property before you signed up movers?
8 A. I don't know.
9 Q. What date were you originally contemplating coming
10 back to the states? In other words, did 9/11 impede your
11 ability to come back?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Did you have tickets purchased?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. And what date were your tickets for?
16 A. I think 9/12.
17 Q. And I take it the airlines weren't flying on 9/12.
18 A. Right.
19 Q. And when did you -- so you had to make new
20 arrangements to travel back to the U.S.?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. And you're saying the earliest you could come back
23 was, what, September 21 did you say?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And were there no flights between 9/11 and
64
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 September 21?
2 A. Not that I could get on.
3 Q. Do you know if the documents you needed to sign
4 were part of the financing for the property?
5 A. I don't remember.
6 Q. Do you recall that the purchase of the Blanchard
7 property wasn't subject to a financing condition?
8 A. I don't know.
9 Q. Is it correct that you arrived back in California
10 on September 21?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And when do you recall signing these documents
13 that you needed to sign?
14 A. It seemed like almost a week later.
15 Q. Do you know what the delay was?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Was there any reason for you to delay the close of
18 the Blanchard property other than the events of 9/11?
19 A. No.
20 Q. Was there any reason to delay the close after you
21 arrived back on September 21?
22 A. No.
23 Q. Do you recall that the seller was complaining that
24 they were incurring costs because of the delay of closing
25 the property?
65
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. What do you recall about that?
3 A. Just Ralph told me there was something about she
4 wanted to sue and he said but we couldn't get you home.
5 But he said she was threatening to sue or something. I
6 don't know.
7 Q. Do you recall that Lynn O'Brien was asking that
8 you and your husband pay some interest costs as a result of
9 the delay in closing?
10 A. Yes, I remember Ralph mentioning it.
11 Q. Is that something you discussed with your husband?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. And did you and your husband agree to reimburse
14 the seller for those interest costs as a result of the
15 delay?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Is there a reason why not?
18 A. Can I wait a minute?
19 Q. Sure.
20 A. I don't -- are you asking about when they asked us
21 to put some money in escrow or something for them, or at
22 Coldwell Banker?
23 Q. Yes. Well, let's start with Coldwell Banker.
24 What do you recall Coldwell Banker asking you to do, if
25 anything?
66
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. No, I don't recall. I just remember Ralph
2 complaining about them asking that, that it was her -- Lynn
3 O'Brien asking that seemed unethical to him. That's all I
4 remember.
5 Q. And these were requests being made by the seller,
6 as best as you can understand?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Do you recall any comments being made about these
9 issues about the delay by Lou Rae Kagel?
10 A. No.
11 Q. Do you recall your husband complaining about Lou
12 Rae Kagel?
13 A. That she asked?
14 Q. About anything.
15 A. That Lou Rae and Doug would even ask this, yes.
16 Q. So Doug Rea had also asked that some money be put
17 into escrow or at least to escrow?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. What specifically do you remember was being asked
20 of you and your husband?
21 A. Well, he told me they wanted some money because we
22 couldn't close and it was a risky thing to do because the
23 seller could go bankrupt or something and we would be out
24 the money. He said it didn't seem ethical to him that they
25 asked that, that anyone asked that.
67
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Anything else that your husband said about Lou Rae
2 Kagel with respect to this delay as a result of 9/11?
3 A. I don't recall.
4 Q. In any event at some point escrow closed, correct?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. And then after September 21, do you recall any
7 additional meetings that you had with Lou Rae Kagel?
8 A. After I came home?
9 Q. Yes.
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. On how many occasions did you meet with Lou Rae
12 Kagel?
13 A. I just specifically remember that one time when
14 she was going off about the air conditioning.
15 Q. Can you describe for me that event?
16 A. She just kept saying the air conditioning worked,
17 and it didn't, and I just remember her seeming like a
18 female version of John Levitz on Saturday Night Live, the
19 way she was acting.
20 Q. I don't know who that is. You're going to have to
21 explain that to me.
22 A. Well, she kept -- she would say, well, it works.
23 We just need another half hour. And Ralph would say, no,
24 it's not on, it's not working; and she says, hmm, we just
25 need to open the window. And she just kept changing
68
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 things, and she was, I thought, very unprofessional and --
2 and loud.
3 Q. Who was present during this meeting?
4 A. Ralph and Ryan and I and Doug and Lou Rae.
5 Q. And this was shortly before the close of escrow?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. And what was the purpose of this meeting?
8 A. I know for sure it was to see if that air
9 conditioner worked.
10 Q. Anything else?
11 A. I don't recall.
12 Q. So at least one of the specific purposes was to go
13 over to the guesthouse and see if the air conditioning was
14 working?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Prior to going over there, had you learned that
17 there was some issue about air conditioning in the
18 guesthouse?
19 A. Yes. I had heard all about -- from Ralph about
20 the air conditioning. They had to put one in.
21 Q. Okay. Was he more specific than that?
22 A. Yes. He said there were -- right here it says
23 there's three zones and there wasn't an air conditioner
24 there.
25 Q. Did he tell you how he discovered that?
69
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. He said he walked around the building and he
2 looked for it and it wasn't there, because it wasn't cool
3 in there.
4 Q. Did he tell you that it was agreed to by the
5 agents that they would install air conditioning?
6 A. Yes, and he didn't like Doug paying for that.
7 Q. And why did he say -- why did he not like that?
8 A. Because he thought Lynn and Lou Rae were probably
9 the ones lying about it.
10 Q. Did he say why he thought Lynn O'Brien was lying
11 about it?
12 A. Yes, she had to know. She built the house.
13 Q. Did he say why Lou Rae had to be lying about it?
14 A. Because she walked around the house, saw no air
15 conditioning and kept saying it was there.
16 Q. And that was at some prior meeting that you
17 weren't at?
18 A. I wasn't there.
19 Q. So let's go back to this meeting. You go there
20 specifically to see if the air conditioning works and I
21 take it you can't get it to come on.
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. And Lou Rae said it works?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And she couldn't get it to come on either?
70
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes. But she kept saying it was on.
2 Q. Were you able to eventually determine that in fact
3 it didn't work?
4 A. Eventually it worked.
5 Q. And how were you able to get it to work?
6 A. Something about the thermostat. I don't recall
7 all this. I mean I only remember this day specifically
8 because it was so loud.
9 Q. When you say loud, describe for me what you mean.
10 A. I mean Lou Rae was very loud about being adamant
11 about this air conditioning being on.
12 Q. As it turned out eventually she was proven correct
13 that it did work?
14 A. She wasn't proven correct that there was cold air
15 coming out.
16 Q. It wasn't working at the point she said it was
17 working?
18 A. It wasn't on.
19 Q. Do you recall anybody making a phone call or how
20 it was determined how to make this thing work?
21 A. Yeah, I recall something about that, yes.
22 Q. Okay. What do you recall?
23 A. I think it was something about the thermostat or
24 something. I'm not positive now.
25 Q. Since close of escrow have you used the air
71
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 conditioning in the guesthouse?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. Do you have any complaints about how it works?
4 A. No.
5 Q. No?
6 A. No.
7 Q. After close of escrow, did you have any other
8 meetings with Lou Rae Kagel other than the meeting
9 discussing the air conditioning in the guesthouse?
10 A. No, I don't recall any.
11 Q. After you came back from the U.K., did you have
12 any meetings with Lynn O'Brien, either before or after
13 close of escrow?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. What meetings did you have with her?
16 A. She came over to the house and tried to take a
17 mirror and I didn't let her. Another time she came over to
18 the house -- this is after close, both of these. She came
19 over to the house and took a griddle off the stove.
20 Q. Describe the mirror incident. Were you living in
21 the house at the time?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. And she came up and rang the doorbell?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And what did she say to you?
72
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. She said that she had come to replace the mirror
2 with another mirror, that that one was one she wanted in
3 her house, and I said, well, you can't just take the mirror
4 off the wall; and then she kept insisting that I should
5 take the other mirror and I said I don't want the other
6 mirror, it doesn't match.
7 And I thought this was crazy after close.
8 So then I threatened to call Ralph and she said --
9 because I was just befuddled by this woman and she was --
10 she -- you just -- she was acting in a very unexpected way,
11 so I -- I said no. Then she asked me did I really need to
12 call my husband, I said no, you can leave now. I'll keep
13 my mirror.
14 Q. And did she leave?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And there was a separate incident with the
17 griddle?
18 A. The griddle.
19 Q. The griddle on the stove?
20 A. She had put a griddle on the stove because her
21 house wouldn't pass inspection because the grill that was
22 supposed to be there was warped. So she had put that
23 griddle on there and then she came over to get it.
24 And I said but you can't take it because then my
25 stove is warped, and she goes but you know what, you can't
73
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 turn this griddle on anyway. She said it doesn't work. I
2 just put it there because it was warped and I wanted the
3 house to pass inspection.
4 Q. Okay. So this is another incident where after you
5 were living in the house she rang the doorbell?
6 A. Yes. And that time I let her out with the
7 griddle. I'm a ding dong.
8 Q. What kind of stove is this?
9 A. Viking. It's a very nice stove.
10 Q. And this is a griddle that goes on top of burners
11 or something like that?
12 A. Um-hum.
13 Q. Yes?
14 A. Yeah.
15 Q. So you turn on the gas to the griddle and to the
16 grill and -- you turn on the gas to the burners and the
17 grill heats up, right?
18 A. Um-hum.
19 Q. Yes?
20 A. Yes. But she had taken the grill off and put
21 something else there smooth to make it look -- because that
22 was warped, so she replaced it.
23 Q. I see.
24 A. And -- I have no clue.
25 Q. Does the stove work okay now?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Yes, but we have a warped grill.
2 Q. And what have you done about that?
3 A. I haven't done anything.
4 Q. Any other meetings that you had with Lynn O'Brien
5 after your return from the U.K.?
6 A. I talked to her on the phone one time.
7 Q. What did you discuss?
8 A. I discussed Lou Rae and I said Lou Rae was talking
9 to us about this air conditioning thing and I said I was
10 very surprised that Lou Rae was so unprofessional acting,
11 and she said -- I just thought she should know since she
12 had listed her house with her; and she said, oh, well, what
13 I'm concerned about is that Lou Rae can't hold a deal
14 together, and then she hung up.
15 That was it. She wasn't -- she didn't seem
16 concerned at all that Lou Rae was acting unprofessional or
17 that I thought -- you know, I said this is silly. This
18 incident didn't need to be like -- so big about the air
19 conditioning.
20 Q. Any other contacts you've had with Lynn O'Brien
21 after that, after you returned from the U.K.?
22 A. No.
23 Q. Have you ever met Jim O'Brien?
24 A. No.
25 Q. Or ever talked to him?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. No.
2 Q. Have you ever met anybody else that you thought
3 was affiliated with the company Stonehenge?
4 A. No.
5 Q. Have you ever met Brian Oram?
6 A. I don't think so.
7 Q. He was a contractor that Lynn had hired, Lynn
8 O'Brien had hired to build the house.
9 Do you recall ever meeting that individual?
10 A. No.
11 Q. Since you closed escrow, you've made some
12 improvements to the house?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. One of the things is you built a pool?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Anything else?
17 A. Some new plants, new plants in the back yard, and
18 a new driveway.
19 Q. Have you taken any steps to determine whether or
20 not the property has fiber optics to keep you in touch?
21 A. Ralph's friend that's a real tech geek said it
22 doesn't.
23 Q. Anything else?
24 A. No.
25 Q. Have you investigated the cost to retrofit the
76
DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 house with fiber optics?
2 A. No. He talked about that and said something about
3 it's hard to do afterwards because of the way the cable
4 bends, but I have no clue.
5 Q. And I take it, just so I understand the issue, you
6 think maybe that has some effect on your computer not
7 running as fast as it could, correct?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. And other than that you're concerned that it may
10 have some impact on the value of the house when you go to
11 sell it?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Otherwise, it doesn't affect your day-to-day life?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. That's correct?
16 A. Correct.
17 Q. And the same is true with the idea of building an
18 additional 800 square foot structure. It doesn't affect
19 your day-to-day life. You're concerned that might affect
20 the resale value of the property?
21 A. Correct.
22 Q. The three zones of heating and air conditioning, I
23 take it you found out it only had three zones of heating
24 and two zones of air conditioning, correct?
25 A. Yes.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. And that's been --
2 A. Rectified.
3 Q. To your satisfaction?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. And the issues about the square footage of the
6 house you knew before you even made an offer, correct?
7 A. We knew there was something up, yes.
8 Q. And I think the other representation you take
9 issue with is the notion that there was a possible pool
10 site.
11 A. Right.
12 Q. Are there any other issues other than what we've
13 just discussed that you have with the property?
14 A. No, not that I can think of now.
15 Q. Okay. Now, did either Lou Rae Kagel or Lynn
16 O'Brien ever point out to you a site on the property that
17 might be appropriate for a pool?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. Who?
20 A. When they were in the house they both said the
21 same place, where the grapevines were.
22 Q. And in fact that's where the pool is today?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. Did you have any interaction with any pool
25 contractors in terms of designing a pool?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. At any point? You mean after we bought the house?
2 Q. At any point, yes.
3 A. Yes. After we bought the house, then I talked to
4 Mike and two other people.
5 Q. You talked to Mike at Swan Pools?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. And you talked to other contractors?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. What other contractors other than Swan Pools did
10 you talk to?
11 A. Royal Pools, and I can't remember the other guy.
12 Q. Did Royal give you a bid?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. And did the other guy give you a bid?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And Swan gave you a bid?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. And why was it you selected Swan Pools?
19 A. Price, but also I liked Mike better for working
20 with in designing the pool.
21 Q. At the time you selected Swan Pools, were you
22 looking at competing designs from these three different
23 contractors?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. Did you tell all three contractors what your
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 criteria was in terms of a swimming pool?
2 A. Yes. We have a Tuscany style home. It had to
3 blend with that and it needed to be a true lap pool, long
4 enough for me to swim laps in, approximately 40, 45 feet.
5 Q. Any other criteria that you specified?
6 A. Waterfall.
7 Q. Anything else?
8 A. I don't remember.
9 Q. How about things like solar, any particular kind
10 of filtration system, any particular kind of chlorination
11 system, anything like that?
12 A. No.
13 Q. Is this the first house you've had with a pool?
14 A. No.
15 Q. Which other houses had pools?
16 A. The house in England had a pool.
17 Q. Oh, that's surprising. Okay. So you had some
18 experience with pools in any event and chlorination
19 features and all that kind of stuff?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. In talking to these three contractors, Royal, Swan
22 and the other guy, did you ask them to incorporate any kind
23 of auxiliary structure?
24 A. No.
25 Q. A gazebo, anything along those lines?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. At that point, no.
2 Q. Well, at some later point did you ask somebody
3 about a gazebo or something like that?
4 A. I asked -- at one point I was thinking of putting
5 a small gazebo at the end of the pool, but then I changed
6 my mind.
7 Q. And you decided that wasn't a feature that you
8 wanted?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. Prior to the time you selected Swan Pools as a
11 contractor, did any of these three contractors suggest to
12 you that there might be an issue with impervious surfaces?
13 A. No, I don't remember that.
14 Q. When did you first discover that there might be an
15 issue with impervious surfaces?
16 A. When the plans were turned in to the city.
17 Q. How did you find out?
18 A. I think Ralph called the city. I'm not positive.
19 Q. Do you recall someone from Swan Pools coming back
20 and saying, hey, we've got kind of an issue here?
21 A. It's kind of blurry. I don't remember how I found
22 that out.
23 Q. Do you know how the situation was resolved?
24 A. Yes. We had to take out cement and put in paver
25 stones.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. Do you know how much time elapsed between your
2 first finding out that there was a problem and then finding
3 out that there was in fact a solution that would work with
4 the city?
5 A. No.
6 Q. A relatively short period of time?
7 A. No. It seemed like a long time because I wanted
8 the pool.
9 Q. Do you recall when you got a building permit for
10 the pool?
11 A. No.
12 Q. I'll represent to you that we deposed a guy from
13 Swan the other day and he said that building permits were
14 available I think either at the end of May or early June.
15 Does that seem about right to you?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. And then it looks like construction didn't
18 actually start on the pool until September.
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Do you know what caused the delay?
21 A. Because they were really busy, Swan Pools, and
22 then if we built it over the -- we couldn't use it until
23 the next spring, anyway, the pool. So we felt like why
24 hurry.
25 Q. When you first agreed to use Swan Pools, did they
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 tell you when they might start construction?
2 A. I don't remember that.
3 Q. Is it correct you knew at that point that they
4 were pretty busy; this wasn't a project they could start in
5 the summer?
6 A. No, not until after we got back -- after it was --
7 I'm not positive.
8 Q. Did Swan Pools tell you in substance that once we
9 have plans approved by you, we have to submit them to the
10 city?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And did they tell you that sometimes that's a long
13 process?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. And I take it by the time you got building
16 permits, Swan said we're busy with other projects; we can't
17 start on this right away?
18 A. I think so, yes.
19 Q. And do you recall being surprised or disappointed
20 by that?
21 A. Well, no. I think I had already figured out it
22 was not going to be built that summer, or it wouldn't be
23 ready until the next spring.
24 Q. And when did you first figure that out?
25 A. When it took so long to get the building permit.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 It was just taking longer to get all the okays.
2 Q. Do you know what the normal amount of time is for
3 the City of Monte Sereno to approve a pool?
4 A. No.
5 Q. Do you know if yours was delayed in any way?
6 A. Yes, because we had to put in the -- we also had
7 to put -- yes. We had to get permission for the paver
8 stones.
9 Q. And do you have any understanding as to what that
10 delay encompassed, a matter of days, weeks, months?
11 A. I don't remember.
12 Q. Other than what's set forth in the brochures which
13 are part of Exhibit 29, do you believe Lou Rae Kagel said
14 anything to you that in retrospect you believe was untrue?
15 A. Do you mean besides the pool and the building?
16 Q. What I'm looking for, things that are not in
17 writing but things that she verbally said to you.
18 A. You mean like standing there saying the air
19 conditioning is on when it's not or --
20 Q. Yes. I want to get a complete list of that.
21 A. Well, she did that.
22 Q. Okay. So she said the air conditioning was on
23 when it wasn't?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. Anything else?
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 A. Well, all of the things about the impervious
2 coverage thing, the driveway and the building. She said we
3 could put a driveway and a building and a pool there.
4 But you mean besides the things on this paper.
5 Q. Yes. I want to focus on things that she told you.
6 So one of the things was the air conditioning she said was
7 on when it wasn't.
8 A. Right.
9 Q. She told you there was a possible pool site.
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. And it turns out you put a pool where she said she
12 thought you could put a pool?
13 A. Yeah, after tearing out the driveway.
14 Q. Do you have any reason to believe that Lou Rae
15 Kagel knew of the issues with the impervious surfaces?
16 A. She gave me a paper that said that. She's a
17 realtor.
18 Q. Other than that?
19 A. She said her husband was a builder.
20 Q. Other than that?
21 A. Other than --
22 Q. She's a real estate agent, there was a piece of
23 paper that said possible pool site and she was a real
24 estate agent and her husband is a builder.
25 A. Yes.
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DEPOSITION OF THOMASENA SIMPSON - 11/15/06
1 Q. From those things you assumed that she knew about
2 the impervious surface limitations in the Town of Monte
3 Sereno?
4 A. She lives in Monte Sereno. Yes.
5 Q. So from all of that you concl